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Author Topic: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?  (Read 131265 times)

Bundu

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #75 on: June 11, 2019, 01:29:17 pm »
very quiet here...... 8)

any thoughts on the NPN/Newco split?
Take more NPN or take Newco?
Tax implications?
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« Last Edit: Tomorrow at 06:13:55 PM by Bundu »

Moonraker

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #76 on: June 11, 2019, 04:07:05 pm »
Quote
In terms of the proposal, shareholders will receive new Naspers M-shares as a
capitalisation issue, which do not have immediate tax liabilities. Capitalisation shares
are exempt from dividend tax, but CGT become payable whenever the shares are sold.
The circular states that the initial cost of these shares for the purposes of CGT will be
deemed to be nil, meaning that the full value of the shares will attract CGT whenever a
shareholder sells them. The M-shares are automatically replaced by NewCo shares,
which is effectively seen as two separate transactions: the sale of M-shares and the
purchase of NewCo shares

Pity about the CGT implications when opting for the M shares, but we should all have losses carried forward
to deduct from that gain. :-X  ;)
No CGT on Naspers N.
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Bundu

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #77 on: June 11, 2019, 04:43:25 pm »
thanks Moonraker  :TU:

what I find a bit weird, is that the normal NPN share should drop when Newco splits off, how come that drop is not discounted and the full value of the new shares are taxed? or am I missing something?

I think I'm gonna take the Newco shares, even if it means an immediate tax burden........  :money:
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« Last Edit: Tomorrow at 06:13:55 PM by Bundu »

jaDEB

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #78 on: June 12, 2019, 04:53:58 pm »
I also will take Newco option on mine.  :whistle:
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jaDEB

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Bundu

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #79 on: July 04, 2019, 12:08:01 pm »
Quote from: jaDEB on June 12, 2019, 04:53:58 pm
I also will take Newco option on mine.  :whistle:

do you know how the tax will be calculated if one goes the Prosus route?

I assume one will retain your old NPNn shares
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« Last Edit: Tomorrow at 06:13:55 PM by Bundu »

jaDEB

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #80 on: July 09, 2019, 08:26:21 am »
If you take Prosus you pay capital gains tax. I am Keeping NPN, as I do not want to be Taxed, I will sell NPN slowly over the years to ensure I minimize capital gains tax. On my Smaller portfolio I will take Prosus and pay capital gains tax.

I looked and NPN will own a big % of Prosus, thus I actually do not see why Prosus would be such a good choice. However my decision is also based on the fact that I already own offshore, Tencent, Amazon and Netflix. I buy offshore every Tax year.

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jaDEB

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Bundu

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #81 on: July 09, 2019, 11:33:02 am »
I saw this yesterday - so with the default option, one keeps your NPNn shares and gets Newco/Prosus shares
I still don't understand where the CGT comes in?

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« Last Edit: Tomorrow at 06:13:55 PM by Bundu »

jaDEB

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #82 on: July 09, 2019, 01:03:17 pm »
The Newco shares will be pure Profit, i.e if you get R100,000 worth of Newco, that will be applicable to CGT as if you sold NPN.

That is my understanding and I based my decision on that.

In terms of the proposal, shareholders will receive new Naspers M-shares as a capitalisation issue, which do not have immediate tax liabilities. Capitalisation shares are exempt from dividend tax, but CGT become payable whenever the shares are sold

The circular states that the initial cost of these shares for the purposes of CGT will be deemed to be nil, meaning that the full value of the shares will attract CGT whenever a shareholder sells them. The M-shares are automatically replaced by NewCo shares, which is effectively seen as two separate transactions: the sale of M-shares and the purchase of NewCo shares.

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jaDEB

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Bundu

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #83 on: July 09, 2019, 01:40:05 pm »
Quote from: jaDEB on July 09, 2019, 01:03:17 pm
The Newco shares will be pure Profit, i.e if you get R100,000 worth of Newco, that will be applicable to CGT as if you sold NPN.

That is my understanding and I based my decision on that.

In terms of the proposal, shareholders will receive new Naspers M-shares as a capitalisation issue, which do not have immediate tax liabilities. Capitalisation shares are exempt from dividend tax, but CGT become payable whenever the shares are sold

The circular states that the initial cost of these shares for the purposes of CGT will be deemed to be nil, meaning that the full value of the shares will attract CGT whenever a shareholder sells them. The M-shares are automatically replaced by NewCo shares, which is effectively seen as two separate transactions: the sale of M-shares and the purchase of NewCo shares.

Aaah OK, that makes sense now, but what will my NPN base cost be after the transaction, seeing that the NPN share price will drop, probably by about 25% of the Newco market cap (I think......)?
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« Last Edit: Tomorrow at 06:13:55 PM by Bundu »

jaDEB

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #84 on: July 09, 2019, 01:56:30 pm »
You take your Total Valued paid for your NPN Shares say you bought 100 at R 1000 total (imagine  :wall:), now you have 120 (new Quantity) bought at R 1000 total.

Please note I only have Standard 6 Lower grade maths.
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jaDEB

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Bundu

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #85 on: July 09, 2019, 08:41:49 pm »
Quote from: jaDEB on July 09, 2019, 01:56:30 pm
You take your Total Valued paid for your NPN Shares say you bought 100 at R 1000 total (imagine  :wall:), now you have 120 (new Quantity) bought at R 1000 total.

Please note I only have Standard 6 Lower grade maths.

yes, that's probably if you choose to take more NPN, but I'm wondering if one takes Newco.... I'll get fully taxed on the total value of Newco and thereafter on the gain above the launch price and my base cost for NPN will remain the same?

I wish there was a simple document that explains all these options and consequences
« Last Edit: July 09, 2019, 09:32:44 pm by Bundu »
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jaDEB

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #86 on: July 10, 2019, 08:02:22 am »
Correct, that is how I also read it.  I was taught, first make your Investment decision, then, only then, do you look at tax implication. Do not let CGT be the start point, your investment 1st, then Tax. It is at this point Patrick starts getting upset and start shouting at me.  :) .

Go . . . . .  :whistle:
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jaDEB

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Bundu

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #87 on: July 10, 2019, 11:09:47 am »
Quote from: jaDEB on July 10, 2019, 08:02:22 am
Correct, that is how I also read it.  I was taught, first make your Investment decision, then, only then, do you look at tax implication. Do not let CGT be the start point, your investment 1st, then Tax. It is at this point Patrick starts getting upset and start shouting at me.  :) .

Go . . . . .  :whistle:
@jaDEB read the below article and maybe reconsider your strategy? It also explains the tax implication better

https://mayaonmoney.co.za/2019/07/nasperss-euronext-listing-plan-a-sting-in-the-tail-for-retail-investors/
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« Last Edit: Tomorrow at 06:13:55 PM by Bundu »

jaDEB

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #88 on: July 10, 2019, 02:51:09 pm »
I want to keep Nasper, as u still have 75 % of Newco + Takealot ? Am I wrong ?
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jaDEB

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Patrick

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Re: Naspers (NPN) - reaching all time high?
« Reply #89 on: July 10, 2019, 03:08:13 pm »
Quote from: jaDEB on July 10, 2019, 08:02:22 am
Do not let CGT be the start point, your investment 1st, then Tax. It is at this point Patrick starts getting upset and start shouting at me.  :) .

Go . . . . .  :whistle:
I actually agree on this one, though at some point CGT becomes a real nightmare. I'm looking at hundreds of thousands when I eventually financially emigrate  :'( :'( :'(
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