Author Topic: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas  (Read 49564 times)

Mr_Dividend

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2015, 09:41:16 am »
You pay 20% foreign dividend tax when it come into the country - that is the only tax that I know - I don't think tax is deducted in the country of origin - could be wrong though. That said, looking at BTI/OML, I only paid 15% - so it looks like 20% on REITS and 15% on dividends for overseas companies.

BTW Just looked it up RPL was the first share I bought in Jan 2013 - at a cost of R5.25 - have bought a few since, avg cost is now R7.72 and makes up 5.9% of my main portfolio.

Fawkes85

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2015, 10:38:32 am »
So 20% taxes in total on dividends for RPL? Also, do you know if they pay dividends quarterly or semi-annually?

Mr_Dividend

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #17 on: September 12, 2015, 10:43:40 am »
Semi

Besides many ETF's, the only property REIT I know that pays quarterly is Arrowhead.

Moonraker

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #18 on: September 12, 2015, 04:50:08 pm »
So 20% taxes in total on dividends for RPL? Also, do you know if they pay dividends quarterly or semi-annually?

I hold RPL and like it.

The UK withholding tax on the so called PID element is 20% (of course no additional 15% withholding tax in ZA). The so called Non PID
element is not subject to UK withholding tax. Taking the cash alternative for the dividends declared for the 6 months  ended Feb 2015 was subject
to the full 20% UK tax. (Opting for scrip has a Non Pid element portion which is free of tax).
However, you will note that sometimes, for reasons unknown to me, e.g. the cash dividends declared for the period ended Aug.2014
also contain a tax free Non Pid portion. Best illustrated in the attached images.
(They are foreign dividends, but are regarded as local dividends for tax purposes - just like SAB, BTI etc.
Real estate investment companies like NEPI ROC etc. are treated the same way for tax purposes but withholding tax is the normal 15% on ZA dividends).

A great Rand hedge that more than held its own during the Aug/Sept turmoil and down trend. See graph.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2015, 05:45:20 pm by Moonraker »

Fawkes85

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2015, 10:33:30 am »
Yeah, you used a lot of fancy words there that I did not understand. Looked at their previous dividends report and also came across PID and non-PID and scrip. Can someone explain to me what these things mean?  ::) ::) ::)

Moonraker

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2015, 12:57:35 pm »
Yeah, you used a lot of fancy words there that I did not understand. Looked at their previous dividends report and also came across PID and non-PID and scrip. Can someone explain to me what these things mean?  ::) ::) ::)
The answer is to be found on their website, copied as shown below:-

Quote
Distributions

As a UK-REIT, Redefine International does not pay UK direct taxes on the income and capital gains from its qualifying UK property rental business (the “Tax Exempt Business”). However, UK-REITs are required to distribute at least 90% of its taxable profits from its Taxable Exempt Business, for each accounting period, in the form of a property income distribution (“PID”) rather than as a dividend. In this way, taxation of income from property is moved from the corporate level to the investor level.

A UK-REIT may elect to designate any additional dividend above the 90% minimum PID, as either a PID or an ordinary dividend (“Non-PID”).

Therefore distribution payments may comprise a mixture of both PID and Non-PID or solely a PID. The amount of PID and any Non-PID elements of each Redefine International dividend will be shown on the associated tax vouchers that will be provided to shareholders within 14 days from the dividend payment date.

Tax treatment

Shareholders should note that the tax treatment of PID and Non-PID dividends differs.

Any Non-PID dividends will be treated in the same way as dividends paid by non-UK REIT companies.

PID dividends have not been taxed in the Company and therefore for most shareholders, PIDs will be paid after deducting withholding tax at the current basic rate of 20%.

Market stats @ close 11/09/15 >>

« Last Edit: September 13, 2015, 01:11:56 pm by Moonraker »

Fawkes85

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2015, 01:53:42 pm »
And what is scrip?

Moonraker

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2015, 02:57:50 pm »
And what is scrip?
I don't believe it. Have you ever subscribed for rights in a rights issue ? Like 10 shares for every 100 held - scrip are the shares subscribed for.  :))

Fawkes85

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2015, 03:19:38 pm »
Well believe it. I have only been an investor since maybe May. So still have a lot to learn. Hence me joining this forum. I don't get what's so funny

Moonraker

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #24 on: September 13, 2015, 03:28:13 pm »
Sorry Fawkes85, judging by some of your posts I was under the impression that you are pretty clued up.  :TU:

yozzi

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #25 on: September 17, 2015, 01:30:56 pm »
I have a UK pension lump sum due in the next few months which will be paid into my UK acc and my intentions would be to invest it in DBX Trackers or similar ETF's in Europe, US, etc but I would like to do this without using a broker and presume the best way is to buy from DBX directly? Would I be saving much on fees, etc? Don't want to bring the funds here prefer to keep the sterling in the UK.

Is this straightforward and easy to do or is it a hassle and best to use a broker?

Also, if you were in the same position where would you invest?

Mr_Dividend

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #26 on: September 17, 2015, 01:58:18 pm »
Do you still have an address and UK bank account? If so, I would open an online account - some do not charge monthly fees and trade fees are lower than SA - beside EE of course. http://www.moneysupermarket.com/shares/

Fawkes85

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #27 on: September 17, 2015, 02:13:49 pm »
If you want to keep your Pounds in the UK you will want to buy into the DBX trackers on the FTSE. DB offers a lot more ETFs in the UK than they do in SA.

Here's a link to their UK site:

https://etf.deutscheawm.com/GBR/ENG/Home

yozzi

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #28 on: September 17, 2015, 02:51:37 pm »
Thanks guys,

Yes, have UK acc and address so good to go and Money Supermarket is an interesting site and not only for shares. Will look into using a share service on there.

Also, the DBX UK site is really informative and performance wise the S&P 500 ETF over 5 yrs being a no brainer with 222% return! What would you be investing in on the UK site? 

Fawkes85

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Re: Investing in SA or taking/leaving money overseas
« Reply #29 on: September 17, 2015, 04:07:49 pm »
Well I am, and have always been, a firm believer in real estate. So I would say invest in a REIT or two. With a P/E of a little over 15 and a P/BV of just over 1.5 Redefine International is selling at a discount right now. You can buy their shares on the JSE under RPL or on the FTSE under RDI.

Caveat: I am not an expert so you definitely will want to look into this yourself and do your own homework.