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Messages - Orca

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1921
Shares / Re: Living off Dividends.
« on: October 02, 2013, 06:25:18 pm »
I have always used the weighted average method and not FIFO. This now gets confusing as now I understand it as like this:

The shares that I add to the other two stocks will have a "zero" date and the older shares in those stocks will still be 1.5 years old.
This will stuff up my weighted ave method. I can't now change to the FIFO method.

1922
Shares / Re: Pulverized Sand Box
« on: October 02, 2013, 05:13:53 pm »
jaDEB  :frustrated: Out the box now please. I have been sitting here for 2 weeks already and will only get out when my stocks recover.

1923
Shares / Re: Living off Dividends.
« on: October 02, 2013, 05:08:06 pm »
As the 3 stocks were not yet held for 3 years, selling a portion of one to add to the other 2 would be revenue on the sell portion.
Due to the fact that I'm still holding the same 3 stocks should not reset the date to zero.
Perhaps SARS would say that "trading" had occurred on that date and reset the date to zero.
 

1924
Shares / Re: Living off Dividends.
« on: October 02, 2013, 03:41:40 pm »
Quote from: orca on Pulverized sandbox
I normally would have sold all by now but cannot as my gains have been too high and I still have a year and a half left to pay CGT instead of normal tax.

So, I guess you now agree with the various people on this thread?

Umm. Not quite, thank you for asking. My next prob now is this.
I have 3 shares that I have held for 1.5 years and 1 of them has grown overweight compared to the other 2. Now if I sell some of the overweight one and add to the other 2, does my "Purchase Date" start all over again?

1925
Shares / Re: CML
« on: October 01, 2013, 02:54:45 pm »
Nice to see you having a good day Orca .....  :TU:
Thanks jaDEB. Sure am after weeks of watching grass grow.
To be expected though because their FY books closed yesterday and as there were no corrections during the last half year, they locked in the profits for Nov report. The profits can only be excellent.

1926
Shares / Re: Tax
« on: October 01, 2013, 02:47:26 pm »
One can use that method only once you have held them for longer than 3 years I presume.

1927
Shares / Re: Tax
« on: October 01, 2013, 02:21:04 pm »
Moon is correct. Page 298 onward. It can be the same share or between similar shares of the same quality.

1928
Shares / Re: Tax
« on: October 01, 2013, 01:09:17 pm »
Just when I thought I was getting a grip on the tax, I read this in the Comprehensive share holder guide.
Not all sales of shares trigger a tax event.
If you rebalance your portfolio by selling some of share X and adding to share Y within 45 days then;
If you made a gain of R2 000 on the sale of X then this gain must be deducted from the cost price of share Y. This lowers the Base Cost of share Y.

If you made a loss of R2 000 then you must add R2 000 to share Y. This increases the Base Cost of share Y.
 :wall:

1929
Off topic / Re: Direct line to Obama ?
« on: September 30, 2013, 05:09:42 pm »
lmao with Orca's pic on the desk......  :LHST:

And to make it worse, they are striking at SABMiller ....  :frustrated:  :wall:  :LHST:

Now you tell me.   :frustrated: The bottle store is closed already. Hic. Burp.

1930
Off topic / Re: Direct line to Obama ?
« on: September 30, 2013, 05:03:28 pm »
 :LHST: Yes. That's me alright. Obi always phones me to ask which shares are going to climb the best for the next 6 months and then he goes short on them.  :frustrated:

1931
Shares / Re: Tax
« on: September 30, 2013, 04:01:22 pm »
Thanks Moon. I still can't find anything on this situation.
Hold the shares for 4 years and then start selling portions per month to supplement income. Will it be seen by SARS as income or CGT?

1932
Shares / Re: Living off Dividends.
« on: September 30, 2013, 09:48:48 am »
A change in your intention will be irrelevant once section 9C applies to your shares. Section 9C deems the proceeds on the sale of JSE-listed equity shares and equity shares in resident companies to be of a capital nature once they have been held for at least three years. Section 9C does not, however, trigger a deemed disposal of your shares held as trading stock after you have held them for three years because the shares technically remain trading stock despite them only being able to produce proceeds of a capital nature.16

16. The shares fall within paragraph (1) of the term"trading stock" in section 1 because they were purchased for the purposes of sale.

Anyone care to explain the above to me?

1933
Shares / Re: Living off Dividends.
« on: September 29, 2013, 08:10:31 pm »
I have read all the "laws" on SARS website. They are so designed  as to give a "doubtful" or "debatable" meaning to the selling of shares as Ernst & Young have stated.
Most of the docs state that the meaning of the docs are not to be used as law and fact.
The court rulings will apply. Not the "laws" as stated.
Having read through many court cases vs SARS I can only conclude that the Intention is the main factor regardless of the "laws".
So if you are selling shares for income, then it will be INCOME and taxed as such. No way to get around this even if you have held the stocks for 40 years.
   


1934
Shares / Re: Living off Dividends.
« on: September 28, 2013, 08:21:22 pm »
I disagree. My last calculation is correct.

Despite guidelines laid down by case law, the determination of whether the amount received or accrued on the disposal of a share falls on capital or revenue account is often a contentious matter which can lead to costly and protracted legal disputes.

As this directly affects me, I have done much research on it. The wording of these "laws" are such that only a court can decide what they actually mean.
Farmer vs SARS. Farmer has had his farm for 35 years and decides to divide his farm into plots and sell them individualy. The court found that his intention was for profit. So his gains were taxed as income.
The sale of your shares for an income will be considered as revenue.

1935
Shares / Re: Living off Dividends.
« on: September 27, 2013, 08:27:42 pm »
No Patrick. My calculations are correct. There is no CGT if you withdraw monthly. It is income and tax is paid at your tax margin as revenue.
You are retired and withdraw monthly for income. It will not be CGT.

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